I have noticed that there are often questions around the internet on what actually shows up when your passport is scanned by the Immigration Control officials of any country. I had a search through the internet and was appalled by some of the silly and often hysterical advice given to people who were obviously anxious and wanted sensible information.
1.) You should have made your post more directly referring to UK Passport holders instead of making sweeping statements regarding all nationalities. For example, this is completely false: "... but the most common beliefs by far are that the different countries have this huge shared common database that they refer to whenever your passport is scanned at Immigration Control..." On the contrary Canada and US share EVERYTHING and your entire record comes up instantly as soon as your Passport is scanned and your identity is confirmed.
2.) You completely misunderstand what the US defines as a crime of moral turpitude. It's not just, "... murder, sexual offenses, major fraud, grand larceny, kidnapping, terrorism..." Being convicted of carrying a single marijuana joint or a simple $10 shoplifting charge is a crime of moral turpitude and it's enough to be denied entry into the US. On the other side of the coin a DUI on your record means nothing entering the US, but it's a huge issue with Canada and is a leading factor in being denied entry.
I understand why you made the post and I commend you for trying to set the record straight, but your OP is far too long and rambling to be easily readable. It doesn't need to be a 1,000+ word essay... if you edited it down considerably and just stuck the facts it would be a very helpful piece of information for Nervous Nellies holding UK Passports.
All the best to you.
Cheers,
Terry
Well thanks...I think...
Actually I did refer at the beginning to the UK Passport office which should have given the readers the idea that the post was aimed at UK passport holders. My apologies if I gave a different impression.
The point I was trying to make and obviously failed at, was that there is no sharing of criminal records between countries other than Canada and the US and this is because they share a border. Canada and the US are only two countries where people travel to, but you could be excused for believing that they are the ONLY countries in the world which are holiday destinations.
In all the posts on the subject that I could find, comments were made assuming that as soon as the UK passport is scanned, it brings up a holder's entire criminal record, which in fact it doesn't. A holder's criminal record is only highlighted if there is outstanding flags, such as those I outlined above.
The point I was trying to make and obviously failed at, was that most people have no idea what moral turpitude actually is, so when faced with that question on the ESTA, tend to just say no anyway, and unless there are outstanding warrants or the holder is on a Watch List, US immigration officials are unlikely to know whether someone has a criminal record or not...whether it be shoplifting, murder or having Mary Jane for personal use. Unless of course they actually tell them. Most travellers don't.
As I said, I was trying to point out that there is no huge central shared database which kicks into action when a UK passport is scanned. I can't speak for US passport holders. I have no idea what information the US Immigration Control demands to be put on their passports.
And to be honest, if I want to write 1000+ essay, I will do so, I don't believe I need your permission. Anyone who really wants information will read the post no matter how long it is. I was only trying to fill in a gap in the abundant misinformation around.
And all the best to you...
Merry Christmas
Sorry I stepped on your toes. I wasn't discounting the spirit of your OP in any way, shape or form. In fact I commended your effort.
That said, in my opinion it's a really long, fairly incoherent, rambling and sometimes misinformed account of a very simple, straightforward situation. That's only an opinion and of course meaningless on an anonymous Internet travel forum so there's no need to get cranky.
Merry Christmas to you too.
Cheers,
Terry
I wonder if Julian Assange's moral turpitude would stop him from gaining entry to the US?
Haha...
Cheers,
Terry
I have been following this thread and have a few comments. Those of us that have been on TP for years have seen the same post repeatedly. "Can I visit the US with a arrest or criminal record." Frequently the poster is from the UK. Most members that have entered the US with the visa waiver program always recommended the same advice. Answer "No" to all questions about criminal or arrest records. Makes sense. US Immigration does not have your criminal record on their computer screen. Or so I thought. We recently had a UK citizen report otherwise. A mother took her daughter and daughter's BF to the US. Her daughter's BF answered 'No' to all the criminal questions using the visa waiver program. When they fingerprinted him, his UK arrest record popped up. He was denied entry, sent home on the next plane to the UK.
I see three choices here.
1. She is lying for whatever reason.
2. We are not getting the whole story.
3. US Immigration can access UK criminal records
If any UK member has first hand experience with recently entering the US with a criminal record, it would be helpful to hear their story.
Mike,
The US and Canada are (to my knowledge) the only two countries on the planet that completely share EVERYTHING in their respective criminal databases. Even more unbelievable is that not only are all convictions shared - no matter how minor or how old - even arrests that don't result in charges being officially laid are shared too. It's disgusting.
The US CBP (Customs and Border Protection) does NOT have access to "normal" UK criminal databases. In other words a DUI in the UK will not show up on the US CBP computer. What they can access is shared databases with several other agencies like Interpol, etc. that track more serious crimes like major felonies.
Of course it's only a matter of time before everything is shared everywhere, just like it is between the US and Canada. That'll be a sad day...
Cheers,
Terry
Sorry Terry, I was a bit cranky. I didn't anticipate being faced with my son's paranoia plus the suicide of my brother in law because he has a progressive wasting illness but has been told under the new UK government rules about disability benefits that he is no longer going to receive it. That happened the day I posted. That's why I haven't been around.
This does seem to be a frequent question. I didn't know how frequent until I searched for an answer. The UK Passport Office were quite firm in what they said. Only if the passport holder has outstanding warrants or belongs to one of the watch list groups will this be flagged up. Also if a passport is forged or reported stolen.
The UK Criminal Records Bureau were also quite firm. They say that there are no plans to link an individual's criminal record with their passport. They said it would be too confusing to even try. However they do share information with other countries if it is requested, but it has to be done through the proper channels.
I guess what you mean by normal is the criminal records that are done and dusted, not ones which are current or ongoing. For example, my son had the conviction from 15 years ago for driving without license or insurance. Both the Passport office and CRB assure me that convictions that are spent are not flagged up on passports. By spent they mean that the sentence given has been completed and the person is not on probation.
Interestingly my son and his fiancee did travel through the US on their way to get married and at that time he answered no to everything on the form they were given. He was allowed entry with no problem. This was in 2002. I am really not sure what kicked him off this time. Stupid information from silly people who make assumptions I suppose.
[ 27-Dec-2010, at 11:30 by Shem ]
As far as I can see everything that you just restated is simply agreeing with everything that I posted.
Sorry to hear about your family troubles.
Cheers,
Terry
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